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the

i a benefit. It was the hopes only of being serviceable to their country, that prevailed on any of them to go thither, and they are doing as much as lies in their power to render their service as beneficial as possible to their country; the sooner that affair is brought to a conclusion, the more beneficial will their service certainly be. This I know to be the case as to the gentlemen that are employed, but if it were otherwise, his Majesty could certainly take care, that no unnecessary delays should be allowed in an affair of such consequence, and certainly will lay before this House an account of all the proceedings in that affair as soon as it can be conveniently done; and therefore I must be of opinion, that there is no occasion for our presenting any such Address as has been moved for.

Mr. Pulteney answered,

Sir; We may always depend on it, that his Majesty will take all possible care of this, as well as of every other affair that regards the honour or the happiness of the nation; but in all affairs his Majesty must employ others under him, he must necessarily employ ministers and other inferior agents, to transact and manage the public affairs of the nation; and as they may be dilatory or negligent, therefore it is the duty, and has always been the practice of this House, to enquire into the management of affairs of great consequence. In the present case I am for the Address proposed, because it will be a spur to the ministers, to procure as speedy and as ample a satisfaction to our injured merchants, as they can possibly get. Our having taken notice, in the last session of Parliament, of the Spanish depredations, procured, I believe, those commissions and instructions, which were last summer sent. to his Majesty's .ships of war in the West Indies: that, I believe, was the chief cause of sending some of our ships to the Spanish coast to demand satisfaction for English merchant ships, which they had violently taken, and unjustly confiscated. One of these captains did accordingly, in pursuance of the instructions he had received, send his boat with his lieutenant and some of his sailors on shore, to demand the satisfaction proposed but the Spaniards were so far from complying with so just a demand, that they added a new affront, by making the lieutenant and the men prisoners; whereupon he like a brave, honest, downright English captain, did what he ought to do, he seized the first Spanish ship he could meet with; but I have been since informed, that this Spanish ship has been restored, though the English ship has neither been restored, nor have the owners met with any satisfaction for the damage and loss they have sustained. How this came about, how we came to restore this ship to them. before they had agreed to release our ship, is more than I know, or can comprehend; for as they had done the first injury, they ought, in my opinion, to have been obliged to have made the first reparation. As to the gentlemen that are em

ployed as our commissaries in Spain, I do not know whether they despise their salaries or not, but I am sure, if they continue as long in Spain as one gentleman seems apprehensive they may, it will verify what I have said in this House in relation to those affairs, that it would have been better for the nation, and more to the satisfaction of the sufferers, to have given up the affair at first, and to have given the sum of money, which such commission might have cost the public, to be divided among our merchants, who had beɛen robbed and plundered by the Spaniards; for even as it is, I am afraid. that if the charges which that commission has already, and will stand the public in, were to be deducted from the sum, which we may recover from the Spaniards by way of reparation, there wil very little remain to be divided among the sufferers.

Sir Robert Walpole observed, That wherever that honourable gentleman got his information, in relation to the restitution of the Spanish ship he made mention of, to his knowledge it was erroneous, for that at the same time orders were sent from hence for releasing the Spanish ship, orders were in like manner sent from the court of Spain, for releasing and restoring the English ship and cargo, which they had before taken; and that her not being restored was no neglect either at this or the Spanish court, but owing to the excuses and delays of his Catholic Majesty's governors in the West Indies; who, notwithstanding express orders from their court for delivering up the ship and cargo, had found some new pretences for delaying it.

Mr. Plumer replied, That if the case was, as the honourable gentleman who spoke last was pleased to assure them, he could not but wtih pleasure observe, that if ever a war should happen between Spain and us, we must certainly get the better of them; for that our governors and officers in the West Indies are, it seemed, most punctual and exact in observing and obeying the orders and instructions received from hence, even though they may be perhaps not much to their own private liking; whereas on the other hand it appeared, that his Catholic majesty's governors and officers in those parts had but little regard to the express orders they received from him; that King, it seemed, having no authority over his own officers; and consequently in case of a war between us, we should have a very considerable advantage over that nation.

At last, the question being put on sir Wil-. frid Lawson's motion, it was agreed to without any division; and the Address was accordingly presented.

Feb. 16. Sir Conyers D'Arcey* reported his Majesty's Answer to the said Address, viz. "That although by the Treaty of Seville, the commissaries on the part of Great Britain and Spain were to meet within four months after the exchange of the ratification of that Treaty, and their commissions to continue for three

* Comptroller of his Majesty's boushold.

years from the date of the said Treaty; and although his Majesty's commissaries were appointed on the 2nd of April 1730, yet by seve ral unforeseen accidents, the meeting of the commissaries in Spain was so long delayed, that the first conferences were not opened till the 23rd of February 1732, N. S. And that as so much time was elapsed before the opening of their commissions, it has been since agreed between the two crowns, that the three years for finishing the commission of the said commissaries, shall be computed from their first meeting on the 23rd of Feb. last; which makes it impracticable for his Majesty to give the proper orders, for laying a perfect account before this House, of what is desired in their Address."

The Debate in the Commons on the Trade of the Sugar Colonies.] Feb. 21. The House resolved itself into a committee of the whole House, to consider of the state of the Trade of his Majesty's Sugar-colonies in America; and Mr. Winnington moved a Resolution, "That no Sugar, Paneels, Syrups, or Molasses, nor any Rum or Spirits, except of the growth or manufacture of his Majesty's Sugar-colonies in America, should be imported into Ireland, but from Great Britain only." This motion was opposed by

Mr. Carey, who said, That he would with all his heart join in any proper measures, that could be proposed, for encouraging our SugarColonies, but he could not agree to the altering the laws as they then stood, with respect to the importation into Ireland: that the allowing of rum to be imported directly into Ireland. from any of our colonies in the West-Indies, was with design to discourage as much as possible the consumption of French brandies in that kingdom; which design would be entirely overthrown by the resolution proposed, if any new law should now be made in pursuance thereof; for if it should be made necessary to bring rum to, and enter it in England, before it could be carried to Ireland, it would very much enhance the price of that commodity, by which the consumption thereof would be discouraged and diminished, and the consumption of French brandies would consequently be in creased: That he thought it was unreasonable to lay such a restriction on the trade to Ireland, because that kingdom was a part of our own dominions, and contributed very considerably to the riches and power of England: That besides, if a law should be made in the terms of the resolution proposed, it would probably embroil us with some of our neighbours: That he did not know but the French would look upon it as a breach of that article of the Treaty of Utrecht, by which it was stipulated, that the trade between France and us should remain on the same footing it was on at that time: That the Portuguese would certainly

Clerk of the Council, and Secretary to the lord-lieutenant.of Ireland.

look on it as a breach of the treaties of peace and commerce subsisting between us and them, because, by such a law the importation of Portagal sugars directly into Ireland would be expressly prohibited. He was answered by

Mr. Screpe, who said in support of the mo tion, That as to the enhancing of the price of rum in Ireland, and thereby discouraging the consumption thereof in that kingdom, there was no such consequence could ensue from the resolution proposed, or from any law that could be made in pursuance thereof, because there might still be as much rum, as was requisite for the consumption in that kingdom, imported directly thither from our own sugarcolonies in America; what was proposed by the resolution moved for, was only to probibit the direct importation of any of the commodities mentioned therein, from any of the other colonies in America, and we had very good reason for making such a prohibition, because it appeared that what was imported directly into Ireland from the other colonies, was generally the produce of the foreign sugar-colonies in that part of the world, whereby the trade of those colonies was very much encouraged and improved, to the ruin of our own sugar-colonies in America: That though we were to look upon Ireland as a part of our own dominions, yet we ought not to allow them to encroach upon any branch of the trade of England: It was very well known that they were always endeavouring to encroach upon trade; and if we did not take care to keep that country under the yoke, they might in time grow so rich as to be able to throw it off, which they would perhaps willingly do, if ever it should happen to be in their power: That as to Portugal, some words might be put in, or some proviso added, for obviating any exception that might be taken by them.

our

Mr. Doddington said, That he was sorry to differ from his honourable friend that sat by him, but that he had always looked on prohibitions in trade as of dangerous consequence, and that therefore no prohibitions ought ever to be laid on it, but such as are in their own nature absolutely necessary: That we had no reason to be jealous of Ireland, or to lay them under any restraints and prohibitions; that country had always appeared loyal and zealous for his Majesty, and for the present royal family; they had generally hebaved as good subjects, at least for many years last past; and he believed the best way to keep them so, was to give them all proper encouragement, and to shun as much as possible the laying them under any particular restraints or disadvantages; That he looked on that kingdom in a different light

*"Mr. Scrope was then Secretary to the Treasury, and was perhaps the coolest, the most experienced, faithful, and sagacious friend the minister had. He was greatly trusted in all matters of the revenue, and seldom or never spoke but to facts, and when he was clear in his point." Tindal.

be no such thing as smuggling in that part of the world; it was to prevent such a pernicious practice, that he proposed only laying a duty on foreign rum; he did not propose a prohibition, and the duty he had proposed was no higher, than what was absolutely necessary for putting our own sugar-islands on an equal foot with the French.

Sir John Barnard replied, That he had said, that our whole army of excisemen would not be able to prevent the running of French rum in that country; he did not talk of reducing the country, he had not so much as mentioned the word, but he believed it would be much easier to reduce the country, than to prevent the running of French rum in it, in case what was then proposed should take effect: that if the gentleman really meant to prevent running, he was very unfortunate in what he had proposed, for he had proposed the only method that could be thought on, for setting up and encouraging the smuggling-trade; which was that of laying on a high duty, equal to, if not above, the first price of the commodity upon which it was laid. Then the question being put, the three foregoing motions were severally agreed to without any division.

After this, the two following Motions were agreed to without any opposition, 1. "That all the Duties charged on the importation of all sugars and paneels of the growth, product and manufacture of his Majesty's Colonies and Plantations in America, into Great Britain, be drawn back on exportation of the same.' ." 2., "That a drawback or allowance of 2s. per hundred weight on all sugars, refined in and exported from Great Britain, be paid on the exportation thereof, over and above all drawbacks or bounties now payable thereon." This last resolution was seconded by

Sir John Barnard, who said, That he would agree to that as well as the other resolution with all his heart, for that the two last were the only resolutions they had come to, which, in his opinion, would be of any real use to our sugarcolonies; and particularly the last resolution he was glad to see moved, because he hoped it would make them think of some other things relating to our trade, which stood in need of some such redress from Parliament: that there were several foreign materials imported into this kingdom, liable to duties on importation, which duties were drawn back, if the materials were again exported in the same shape; but if manufactured and made more valuable by the labour of our own people, neither the merchant nor the manufacturer could draw back the duties, even though they should afterwards export the same, and could shew that this manufacture was made of materials that had paid a duty on importation; and would have had a drawback on exportation, if they had been carried out rough as they were brought in: that this was a scandalous oversight when these duties were first imposed, but it was much more scandalous that in so long a time this oversight had never been amended: that there

were several examples of this oversight could be given, but he would then only mention the duties on foreign hemp, flax, cordage, &c. which were drawn back if the goods should be exported in the same condition they were imported: but if these very goods should, by the labour and industry of our own people, be manufactured into cables, ropes, and other tackle for shipping, and then exported, the exporter could not have any drawback: that this was a great loss to that branch of our trade, which was a very considerable branch, but would be much more considerable if it were not for this hardship it laboured under.

These Resolutions being all agreed to, a Bill was ordered to be brought in pursuant thereto, which afterwards passed into a law.

again lost in the House of Lords.] The same The Pension-Bill passes the Commons, and is day, the Pension Bill was read the third time and passed; and Mr. Sandys was ordered to carry it up to the Lords, where it met with the

same fate as in the two last sessions.

Debate on Sir R. Walpole's Motion for issuing 500,000l. out of the Sinking Fund, for the service of the year 1733.] Feb. 23. The House resolv'd itself into a Committee of the whole House, to consider farther of ways and means for raising the supply; the Account of the money then remaining in the Exchequer, and of the produce of the Sinking-Fund disposable by Parliament, having with others been referred to the said Committee, Sir Robert Walpole stood up, and spoke as follows;

Sir;

In the last session of parliament, this House came to a Resolution, which, in my opinion, was a good and most reasonable resolution; and that was to ease the landed interest of one shilling in the pound upon the Land-tax, by granting in lieu thereof, a duty on Salt for three years. By this the landed interest, which has for so many years borne so great a share of the public expence, has in this last year found a most sensible ease; and if any method can be fallen on for continuing this ease to them, such method ought certainly to be followed. As I had, last session of parliament, the honour of moving for that Resolution, the approbation I then met with encourages me now to offer to your consideration another motion,* which I hope will be equally agreeable, and that is, that it may be resolved, "That it is the opinion of "this Committee, that towards raising the Supply granted to his Majesty, there be issued

"and applied the sum of 500,000l. out of "such monies as have arisen from the Sur"plussés, Excesses, or overplus money, com"monly called the Sinking-Fund, over and "above what hath been applied to the payment of one million, towards discharging the "national debt, pursuant to an act of the last "session of parliament." This motion, I hope, will meet with the approbation of this House; for it has always been my opinion, and I believe it will be granted by every man, that the public expence ought always to be raised ac cording to that method, which is the least burthensome to the people: by this method we shall provide for a great part of the current service of the year, without laying any barthen whatever on the people, and without doing in

country, met with such violent opposition, as induced the minister to relinquish it.

"When the House of Commons passed an act for the establishment of a fund for applying the surplusses of duties and revenues to the liquidation of the National Debt, called in subsequent acts the Sinking Fund, the words to appropriate them to that purpose were strong as could be found, to and for none other use, intent, or purpose whatsoever.'

as

During the whole reign of George the First it was invariably appropriated to its ori ginal purposes, and rather than encroach upon it, money was borrowed upon new taxes, when the supplies in general might have been raised, by dedicating the surplusses of the old taxes to the current services of the year. Even in the infancy of the establishment, when its operations were necessarily very con fined, great advantages were derived even from this small surplus; the national interest was immediately reduced from 6 to 5 per cent.; 750,000/. in old exchequer bills were paid off in 1719 and it appeared, by the report of the House of Commons, that from 1717 to 1728, it had discharged 2,698,4167, and that its average amount was 1,200,000l.

"It no sooner attained this progressive power, than its operations were suspended. Between 1727 and 1733, several encroachments were made, either by alienating the taxes which yielded the surplusses, or by charging the interest of several loans upon the surplusses appropriated to the payment of the debt. But although this measure was in effect the same as depriving it of gross sums (there being no difference between taking the annual interest of a sum, and that sum itself) yet as these encroachments were not literally direct invasions of the fund, they seem to have met with little opposition.

"However, in 1733 an open attack was made. Half a million being voted for the service of the ensuing year, the minister proposed to take that sum from the Sinking Fund, and by that means to continue the Land tax at one shilling in the pound; adding, that if this motion should be objected to, he should move for a Land Tax of two shillings in the pound, there VOL. VIII.

justice to any man, or to any set of men: The case of the creditors of the public is now very much altered from what it was; the competition among them is not now which of them shall be first paid, but which of them shall be the last to be paid; and therefore gentlemen need not now apprehend, that any of the public creditors will look upon the House's agreeing to this motion as an injustice done them, or as any hardship put upon them; on the contrary, they will look upon it as a favour, and would be glad that a much larger part of that. fund were to be applied in the same manner. This motion ought the rather to be agreed to, more especially by those who have a regard for the landed-interest, because we can thereby continue to the landed-gentlemen that ease which we granted them last year; whereas if

being no other means of providing for the current expences.

"This motion justly occasioned a long and violent debate, and the strength of the argument undoubtedly lay on the side of opposition. The whole substance of the reasons, which the minister could urge in defence of this violation of his own principles, was the necessity of giving ease to the landed interest, and the dread of the public creditors to have their debts discharged. On this occasion be advanced this remarkable position, that the situation of the country, and the case of the public creditors was altered so much since the establishment of the Sinking Fund, that the competition among them was not who should be the first, but who should be the last to be paid, an assertion, which none of the opposition ventured to contradict, and therefore may be considered as true. He also added, that although the Sinking Fund was established for the payment of the debts, yet it was still subject to the disposal of parliament; and whenever it appeared, that it could be more properly and beneficially applied to some other use, the legislature had a power, and ought to dispose of it in that manner.

"On the other side, the opposition argued, that the sacred deposit for discharging the debts and abolishing the taxes, ought not to be applied to any use, except in cases of extreme necessity, which were not now apparent; that the assenting to the motion was in fact robbing posterity of 500,000l. and the progres sive interest of that sum, for a trifling ease to themselves. They reminded him of his inconsistency, in destroying his own darling project, and undermining the boasted monument of his own glory; and sir John Barnard emphatically urged, that the author of such an expedient must expect the curses of posterity.'

"These arguments, however, did not affect the decision of the House of Commons. The influence of the minister, aided by the co-ope ration of the landed, monied, and popular interests, triumphed over opposition; and the motion was carried by a majority of 110 voices; 245 against 135." Coxe's Walpole. 4 H